Welcome to Unshaken

Kristy 0:06

Welcome to Unshaken, the podcast where unwavering faith meets real life. I'm Kristy, and together with my husband Tony, we dive into authentic conversations offering biblical insights and sharing stories that inspire resilience, especially for families navigating the unique challenges of disabilities. Join us each week as we explore faith family and the journeys that keep us grounded in Christ. Don't forget to subscribe so you never miss an episode. Let's stand firm together. Hi friends. Welcome back to another episode of Unshaken. This is Kristy, and I'm here with Tony. And as usual, there's been kind of a topic this week that has sort of risen to the top of our car time. So as usual, we're bringing it to you guys. And what we've really been talking a lot about this week is how there are sort of seasons of life where we're doing everything you know to do. You're working hard, you know you're doing all the right things, but somehow nothing seems to be changing. You're not seeing results. It's just you got started, you had a plan, and you're just working, working, working. It's that grind section. You're hoping to get whatever the end game is, no sign of it yet. And I think this happens all over our lives, right? I think it can happen in parenting. It certainly can happen in marriage, in health situations. I think in our spiritual lives, ministry, it happens in leadership all the time. I think it happens, I mean, even in caregiving. I think we've we're programmed to, as we work, we want to see sort of incremental progress. We want to see those mileposts pop up. We want to see that we're actually getting somewhere. And then we're we're really driving toward that end. And it's tough. It's tough to not have that kind of feedback.

Tony 2:01

For

The Exhaustion of the Middle

Tony 2:02

many of us, being in that middle is more tiring than we want to admit. In the beginning, we've got all this energy to get going and get working on this thing. And when you're at the end and you can see the light at the end of the tunnel, you kind of get a jolt of like adrenaline and you Yeah, like that second wind thing. Yeah, you get a second wind and you're like, okay, I can finish, it's it's all good. But when you're in that middle, it can kind of feel like you're in sludge and you're working and you're working hard, but there's a lot of uncertainty in that middle because you are in the middle. You can't see where you've come from sometimes, and sometimes you can't see where you're going. But you're gonna keep working, you're gonna keep trying hard, and like there's nothing visible to see or to point to as far as results go, but you're working hard and you know it, and and maybe you're the only one that does know it, that you're the only one that's working hard. Maybe no one around you can actually see the effort that you're making. And that can be tough in in and of itself, especially when you're trying to build something, especially when you're in leadership and you're trying to build something. So I hope that as we share our stories and we share our experiences, that you guys don't hear, hey, this is what you should be doing. Rather, you hear, hey, we've been there.

Kristy’s Story of Rebuilding a Campus

Kristy 3:36

That brings me to this story that I wanted to share with you guys. And so this happened to me, it was several years ago. Gosh, maybe more than several years ago, as I think about it. Um, I worked for a school that had several campuses. And I was working on one, I was working on kind of a larger campus, and then I got a call, was asked to go to another campus, a smaller campus where the dean had just been dismissed. For a dean to be dismissed, it's things have to be pretty far off the beaten path. Um, and as it worked out, for the guy that was before me there, because I did take, you know, I did agree to go. He had been one of those sort of in the office with the door shut kind of guys working on paperwork, reports, but wasn't super visible to students, wasn't super visible to his team. And when I got there, there were classes running. It was like the second week of a of a term, classes running week to week with substitute teachers. Like it was really bad. The reason that happened is because a bunch of people had just quit. When I went in, it was really discouraging just to show up and kind of see what kind of shape things were in. As quickly as I could, I made some hires and I we're always sort of taking a leap of faith, right? We can ask all the questions and and ask for the, you know, the references and the resumes and whatever. But at the end of the day, you know, we're just we're really hopeful that it'll be a good match. And and in hindsight, um, you know, they were. They were some good hires. But again, it's one of those things where you you kind of like start out and then we have to wait, right? I knew that culture change was really what we needed. And it's hard, right? Because before you can change culture, you have to have some kind of stability. People needed support. I think the faculty had been unsupported and also unattended for a long time. So, you know, they were taking some liberties that they felt entitled to because there was nobody there when they needed help with something. You know, so we started there, we started to invest in those relationships and just work toward a comprehensive culture change for the whole campus. And I believe that that starts with the team. It starts with the faculty. And then as people feel more comfortable and are happier and are more supported, that you know, it becomes more visible to students and then things start to really feel different. But I think that's the key, right? Is that things really did start to feel different after a few months. But what didn't come was the changes in metrics. And what I was held accountable for was not for things to feel good, it was for those metrics. I was hopeful that it would come and I really believed I was doing the right thing, but man, it was scary.

Questioning the Work When Metrics Lag Behind

Tony 6:28

For me, as I'm listening to you, Kristy, as you're going through this, did you ever start to question yourself or or question what you were doing?

Kristy 6:37

Yes, all the time. Every time I had a report due and I knew that what what they were looking for was not gonna be there, yes. Every time I was gonna have a phone call with uh with my own boss, uh, yes. There were easy ways to to make numbers happen fast, but they don't mean anything. What I was looking for was a change in culture. I mean, you can't fake that. You can't you can't fake it, but it also doesn't necessarily show up in those metrics that you know that people are looking at.

When Numbers Don’t Tell the Whole Story

Tony 7:12

A lot of times when we think about metrics and we think about the things that people are looking for, we're talking about numbers. Sometimes the numbers don't match what you feel, and sometimes the numbers don't match what you see. If you guys will indulge me for a minute, where I see this happening a lot is I see this happening in baseball. Baseball has become so analytic heavy, there are stats and metrics for everything, and it's very easy to get to a point of like managing from a spreadsheet or managing from a binder or a laptop. But so many times when you're managing a baseball team, you gotta manage with your eyes. You gotta see what your players are actually doing on the field, even if the numbers don't automatically match at that point in time. What you see matters and what you feel matters.

Kristy 8:16

Yeah, I'm with you. I mean, I for me, I'm not a a baseball by stats kind of person at all. Like, how does it feel to sit in the stands? How does it feel you know to experience the game the way it's being played? I I think that has so much more immediate relevance, I think. User experience, like what's happening in the in the meantime with the fans? Like what's you know, how does that feel? And how is it being impacted by this, by the, by the drive for metrics?

The Danger of Worshiping the Numbers

Tony 8:47

Obviously, there there are so many other environments where this touches our daily lives. With a podcast, people ask, well, how many followers do you have? How many downloads do you have? How many, you know, listens or this or that? When it comes to ministry, how many churches do we know that count salvations or they count baptisms or they count you know Sunday morning attendance? And you know, there are people that are literally counting heads as you know the the service starts every Sunday morning. There's a real danger in worshiping the numbers, and we stray from the faithfulness that we're being called to when we're in the middle of these seasons. It would be really easy to start chasing numbers, and that's not what God is calling us to do.

Kristy 9:43

I think you're

When Important Growth Cannot Be Measured

Kristy 9:44

right. I think that some of the very most important things in life are pretty much impossible to measure while they're happening, whether it's trust or safety, spiritual maturity, like there's so many things that you can't really measure. And we have to trust that whatever we're doing, we're doing it, you know, in theory, because God has asked us to. Like if if we're getting it right, you know, if we're we're praying and we're hearing his his call to us, you know, but somehow we just rather than just leaning into that and trusting that, you know, if if we're faithful, what's meant to be will happen, we really are looking for reassurance all along the way. Um, and when we don't get it, it can be really discouraging. You know, we might be tempted to just, you know, to stop, to quit. We wonder like, does this effort matter? Is what we're doing making any difference at all?

Justifying the Work When Results Are Hidden

Tony 10:38

There is a real pressure that many of us feel to justify the work that we're doing, whether it's in our parenting, or in our marriage, in our ministries, things may look good on on the outside, but on the inside, there's so much turmoil because we're beating ourselves up because we don't have the numbers that we think we should have. But when we can stay grounded in trust and patience and having the endurance and having the tenderness that God is calling us to, that growth that we're looking for can come slowly and can come quietly at times.

Ministry, Relationships, and Slow Trust

Kristy 11:26

So it seems like a lot of this is stuff that that you or even we have gone through ministry-wise.

Tony 11:32

When it comes to ministry, there's so much that has to be done and it mirrors what you went through because so much of ministry is relationship building. When you are building those relationships, that's not going to show up readily on a spreadsheet. When you're trying to fundraise, for example, and you're trying to get the resources that you need to build a ministry program, you can't go up to a complete stranger and say, I need X amount of dollars for this program, can you give it to me? Well, they don't trust you, they don't know you, they're not gonna give you a dime. But if instead you cultivate the relationship and you invest in that person and those people and you love on them well and you minister to them, invest in them, then they see what you're doing, it's a lot easier to say to them then, Will you partner with me in helping get this ministry, you know, off the ground? When we want the reassurance that what we're doing is the right thing, that's human. And that's okay to like desire that reassurance. We just have to again just make sure that that doesn't become the focus of what we're doing, but we rather keep the focus on what God has called us to do in this middle season. There's so many places in scripture that kind of model this and and mirror this and first need to just start with Jesus and how you never read in scripture

Jesus Was Never in a Hurry

Tony 13:23

that Jesus ran anywhere. Jesus walked and he was never in a hurry. Jesus was walking with a purpose, he obviously knew the father's plan and did what the father wanted him to do, but there was no hurry in any of it. So many examples, Moses who led the people out of Egypt and got them ready to go into the promised land, but he himself didn't end up going into the promised land. And all of the things that led up to him leading the people, God prepared him with all the time that he spent in the wilderness, all the time that he understood how to live in the desert.

Kristy 14:15

Yeah,

Being Changed by the Process

Kristy 14:16

so that uh what I'm hearing is that he didn't get the outcome that he was looking for. It was it wasn't meant for him. What he got was the ability to set up the next guy for success, but also the change that occurred in him. And I think that's a really good point, Tony, that you made is because the process sometimes what we get out of it is is the way it changes us, the way it refines us, um, but the way that it makes us ready for, you know, maybe for the outcome that that is coming because of our hard work. Maybe that outcome isn't coming, but God has something different for us. And by the pursuit of of what we thought we were after, we're being made ready for what is really to come for us. Um I just think across the board, I I think even maybe when we do get the results eventually, it's we're just we're changed. We're changed by that sort of blind, you know, adherence to faith and and just trusting in what he has for us.

When the Outcome Is Not What You Expected

Tony 15:26

When you are in a season of growth, there's always two outcomes. One the ending that you thought was coming, comes, and then at when that ending comes, guess what? There's another mountain for you to climb, and there's another season for you to enter. That's one that's one possibility. Another possibility is you think of an outcome, and God says, Nope, that's not for you. But in in what you're doing, it prepares you for what he actually wants you to do. And this happens over and over in scripture. One of the the the guy that specifically comes to mind is David. You know, David number one had no idea that he was going to be anointed king, and yet everything that God had had let him go through as as a shepherd boy, you know, as he was protecting and looking after his father's flocks, got him ready for the leadership position of being a king. And even at the end of David's life, he thinks that he is going to build a temple for God to dwell in, and God tells him, No, that's not for you. The temple's gonna be built by one of your sons. And so does David in that moment sit and pout? No. He does everything that he can to get things ready with the materials and the plans and all the people that his son is going to need in order to construct this temple. And so sometimes what we're doing, like Kristy said, it's not for us, but it's for those that are going to come after us, and it and it makes me think of what Paul told the Galatians when he wrote to them, he's it's in uh Galatians chapter six, verse nine, it says, Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up. What he doesn't say there is we're gonna reap the harvest that we expect. No, we're gonna reap the harvest that God lays out for us. But the important thing is that we don't give up. It may be hard and may it may be full of uncertainty, but God is calling us to be faithful in those moments and not grow weary and not give up.

Kristy 18:46

I

Seasons of Building and Risk

Kristy 18:47

think it happens across the board, right? With uh with seasons of building, seasons of, you know, um, I mean, literal seasons, sports seasons, let's say, um, where, you know, a team is created or or a team loses a bunch of great players and we know that the next, you know, however long is gonna be them getting it back together, right? We're not expecting a bunch of wins, we're not expecting a great season. Uh, we're expecting, you know, to do that work and um, you know, and hope that that we don't lose fans along the way, hope that, you know, this this season of, you know, just toil, this season of growth, of of learning, um, you know, of coming together. We hope that at some point that it does pay off. Um, but we have to keep moving toward it, just believing that we're doing the right things, believing that we're doing the things that will bring the desired outcome. Um, you know, if it's the same with with kids in school, kids learning to read or um pursuing a grade, or, you know, whatever the case is, a semester's long. It's 16 weeks. Um, you know, and it's a it's a lot of a lot of hard work that goes into the pursuit of something that we're not guaranteed. There's just so many places where this happens. For how many of us does it happen at work? I know um, you know, I was talking about the example um where I used to work, but I mean, I think this happens all the time. I mean, every even now, like going into we're wrapping up a school year. Um, there's a brief that we've got two weeks between school years here, you know. So already I'm working on plans for the upcoming year and I'm looking at making some pretty significant changes. Um, and all I can do is is work as hard as I can and do the things that I believe are the right things and and hope that I'm driving toward a good outcome. There's risk, right? There's risk in um, you know, in the pursuit of of what God has for us just because we don't, you know, we can't know. We can't know for sure that we're we're doing the right things or whatever. And and we don't always get that the feedback, the input, sort of the the markers, I guess, of of success. Um but we have faith, right? And we have that biblical hope, you know, where we can expect an outcome at some point. Um, it may not be the one we had in mind, but there will be an outcome because he has a plan for everything and for every one of us. And he doesn't waste our work. Um, you know, even when we're getting it wrong, there are there's lessons in it, right? There's growth and all of those processes just moving toward what we think we're looking for. They're changing us, they're refining us, they're sharpening us, they're um building our skill set. And um, you know, we Talked about a lot of examples where we're not the one that gets the I guess payoff, you could say. Um, but there are so many examples where um, you know, if we worked in this season and and we did everything that we thought we could do, the answer ended up being we did not get what we wanted, but man, we are ready, we are ready to go on what actually does come. And uh I think that's that's not a small thing. It's something to not overlook. Whether the near outcome comes or doesn't come, what is it preparing us for next?

Tony 22:37

It

Faithfulness Still Matters Without Visible Success

Tony 22:38

begs a question: does faithfulness only matter if it eventually produces some sort of visible success? And the question it the the answer to that question is no. You know, faithfulness still matters, obedience still matters, love and consistency, our character still matters, even if we don't see the visible or the numbers uh show up, and prime example of this is Abraham, way back at the very beginning of Genesis, God told him, Go and I will show you a land flowing with milk and honey that you and your descendants will inherit. And here's the thing, guys, Abraham lived his entire life. He never saw his descendants inherit that land, but he was still called faithful. Every time that you read you know the ending of like one of one of his passages, the same phrase shows up over and over, but Abraham was faithful to what God commanded him to do, and that faithfulness matters. We still talk about him because he was faithful. When you're going through these seasons, it's not about this rah-rah, God's gonna work it all out, it's about having that sturdy hope and that sturdy confidence that God is present, that God is looking for our obedience, it's not wasted, and that faithfulness, even if it's hidden in numbers that never show up, is still faithfulness. It matters.

Kristy 24:47

What

Growth That Happens Underground

Kristy 24:48

this brings to mind for me is um is that so much of the growth that happens happens in the dark. It happens underground, it's happening where we can't see it going on. Um, you know, you guys know that I'm a plant girl. Um when we plant a seed, before anything visible happens, that seed is it's it's pushing downward, right? The roots come out. Um, you know, it it first of all, it has to, you know, it has to be in the ground a hot minute. And we're watering it and the sun shining on it, and you know, if we're encouraging it, um, you know, and then we get those roots and we don't see anything happening from up above. We see literally just dirt. Um, but it's it's working hard, you know, and it's doing all the things that seeds do. And then eventually, you know, with time, um, some of the seeds will sprout and we'll see, you know, we'll see that little tinge of green on that dirt. Um, you know, and and if we're lucky, you know, eventually it brings flowers or carrots or whatever it is that we're growing. Um, but there's so much that happens before we can even see it. And it's it's the most important, most foundational stuff that's happening. Um, you know, back to the beginning, it's it's culture before metrics. Um, it's it's building trust, you know, with with possible donors before we can ask them for funding. Or um, you know, it's it's building trust in a relationship before we can before we can ask for vulnerability. Um it's it's building endurance uh before we can before we can look for confidence. Like we can't have the expectation of the second part without the first part. Um but that first part so often happens in the dark. Um, that sort of formational stuff is usually really quiet.

Tony 27:00

It's

Let God Be Lord of the Harvest

Tony 27:01

important that we continue to plant seeds, we continue to love on people, we continue to pray, and we continue to show up in these seasons, not give up because God is working with us in those hidden places. Um we need to make sure that as we continue to keep trusting that we just let God do what he's going to do and let him be Lord of the harvest. Let him be in charge of the results and just stay faithful to the work.

Kristy 27:43

You're exactly right. If it's the faithfulness, the obedience, the consistency, it's our character, right? It's I think who we are is shaped in those seasons of of toil without visible results. Thing is guaranteed, except that God is with us throughout the whole process, even when we're working in the dark.

Tony 28:07

Hopefully that gives us the confidence to not grow weary and not give up, but instead trust in God's goodness to bring about the harvest that He is looking for.

When You Keep Showing Up

Kristy 28:26

So, friends, if you are currently in a season where you keep showing up, you're you're working so hard, and nothing seems to be changing, if you're not getting those indicators of change or growth, you're not seeing the markers or the metrics that you're looking for, maybe the story's just not over yet. Maybe it's just not time yet. And that's okay because when you look back on what you're doing and the choices that you're making and just the investments, the work, the time that you're putting in, you know, the prayerfulness, the intentionality of the work that you're doing, you know that you're doing the right thing. You know, and and maybe what you're doing is that truly, truly most important work that's just still happening underground. And that's it's okay. It's better than okay, right? That's that's God's plan. It's what he wants for us, it's what he has for us.

Closing Prayer

Tony 29:27

So let us go to him in prayer. Let us um thank him for what he has done so far and what he will do in the midst of these seasons when we are in the middle. So, Father, we come before you today. Um, again, thankful uh for your love and for your guidance and for your faithfulness. Father, we ask that you would continue to give us strength and endurance so that we do not become weary in the good that you have called us to do. Help us to not give up. Help us to just push forward and know that you are w with us in the hidden places and in all the places that don't show up on a spreadsheet, don't show up on a shiny metric, but you are still there. So thank you, Father, for always being there for us. Thank you for your son, who was such a great example of not being in a hurry, but instead moved with purpose because he had confidence in you. Help us to have that same confidence. We love you, Father. We thank you for the salvation that we have found in your son, and it's in your son's name that we pray. Amen.

Kristy 30:59

Amen.

Until Next Time

Tony 31:01

Thank you so much, guys. Hope you guys have a great day and a great rest of your week, and we'll see you next time.

Kristy 31:07

Bye, friends. Take good care. We love you.