Kristy 0:06

Welcome to Unshaken, the podcast where unwavering faith is real life. I'm Kristy, and together with my husband Tony, we dive into authentic conversations, offering biblical insights and sharing stories that inspire resilience, especially for families navigating the unique challenges of disabilities. Join us each week as we explore faith, family, and the journeys that keep us grounded in Christ. Don't forget to subscribe so you never miss an episode. Let's stand firm together. Welcome to Unshaken. This is Kristy, and I'm here with Tony. I want to start by telling you guys a story. As I was growing up, anytime my mom would pick up a little treat for one of us, my sister, my brother, or me, or one of us would get a little attention, something extra, we would always make the joke like, oh, your mom's favorite, or oh, I'm mom's favorite. And my mom would always say, You guys, you know, my favorite is the one who needs the most. And as a kid, I kind of always thought, like, oh, that's just a very mom thing to say. Like she never, you know, she never would tell us who's the favorite or whatever. But as an adult, thinking back on that, it hits me totally differently now. Fast forward a little bit to when I was pregnant with our second, and our first was the bell of the ball her entire life. Uh, she was like the first grand kid for you know, in in like 15 years, she was the sunshine in that solar system. And we were thickest thieves, her and me. We were besties. And we were school shopping. So her sister was due at the end of June, 1st of July. So we're doing some school shopping, like before the baby came, and we're standing in the checkout, and out of the blue, just out of nowhere, she says to me, When my baby sister's born, you're still gonna love me the most, right? And I I'll never forget how it felt and how out of nowhere it came, and how immediately I'm thinking, like, she must be seriously carrying this around with her. Thank you so much to God. What I came with was mommies have to love all their babies the same. You're always gonna be the one that made me a mommy, and your sister's always gonna be the baby, but you're each gonna always have a place that is just yours. Like it's you she'll never ever be the one who made me a mommy, and you're always gonna be the big kid. And I kind of left it at that. Talk about full circle on that thing that we had growing up.

Tony 2:41

As I'm listening to you tell the story, the bottom line is that in both cases, both you and your mom internally asked the same question. You both were asking, what does this little person need? Where is this quietly coming from as far as if they still matter? You know, in the case of Felicity, it wasn't she wasn't really asking about the baby, she was asking, you know, will I still matter? Will I still have my place? Is there still enough love for me, knowing all the things that were being done to prepare for her baby sister? That last question, especially, is there still enough love for me? Maybe that's the question that every family member asks whenever someone else's needs become greater than maybe greater than average. It's a fair question to ask, especially when there's disability involved. There's a lot of siblings that are mulling these questions, and sometimes they're mulling these questions from a silent place. Every family experiences seasons where one person needs more. Sometimes that season is temporary in the case of like a new baby, or maybe there's illness, or there's a job loss, or maybe there's a mental health crisis, maybe there's aging parents in the mix. Sometimes family life becomes uneven, not because anyone did anything wrong, but because need in and of itself can sometimes be uneven. But I think it's important that we also acknowledge that for some families that unequal need is just not a temporary thing, it becomes part of the daily life, and disability is one of the big levers of that. Sometimes it's a chronic illness, sometimes just the caregiving rhythms that have to happen every day. Sometimes we have needs that just don't resolve on a normal timeline. There's not, well, we're just gonna do this and then everything will go back to normal. Normal is what we are dealing with right now. I don't wanna move past this and just pretend like it's all easy and it's all temporary because for many of us it's not temporary, and it's not easy. It's more than just how do we get through this hard season? I think more to the point, it's how do we love faithfully when the needs in our family may never be evenly distributed.

Kristy 5:46

Thinking about what my mom always said, that the it was always the one who needed her the most was the favorite. You're right. I mean, I I think there are seasons of life where one is the one who needs the most, and then there are lives where the season is going to last forever. It's always going to be that way. So we come to a situation where there is an unequal amount of attention, let's say. I'm not even sure the right way to word that, but certainly not unequal love. As a mother, what I'm thinking about is it fair time-wise? Am I getting time with both kids? Am I giving both kids my time? This kid has appointments twice a week, whatever. It might be speech therapy or OT or PT, it could be anything, you know, doctor's appointments. It's not only we're we're giving that time to the kiddo whose appointment it is, but we're also probably dragging along a sister or a brother who it has nothing to do with, and they're just having to go. Conversations, you know, have have I had a deep conversation? Have I really been able to connect with both kiddos, all the kiddos? Am I shorting one on my on the best of my energy? There's just so many ways that parents kind of measure this stuff, right? Is the financial situation skewed so heavily in favor of the one who needs that the other kiddo just doesn't enter the equation with wants and things like that? Are we missing opportunities for one because of the other? It's just there's so many heavy things. And I think parents keep that kind of score because we're afraid that in this equation that we see life as that somebody's losing, that one kid is winning and the other kid is losing. But I don't know that kids see it the same way.

Tony 7:36

I don't think that children keep score the same way, they're not counting the things the same way. I think a lot of times kids are asking, Am I safe? Do I belong here? Do you still enjoy me as I am? Am I still important to you? Equal attention is not the same as equal love. We know that life isn't going to always be fair, but again, it's not about, well, I spent five minutes here, so I've got to spend five minutes there. It's not like that. A child isn't gonna be counting minutes that way. It's easy for us to do that. Time is the thing that we're always looking at, but our kids are more looking at our body language, our tone. Are there moments of just pure delight that we're sharing with them? Are there moments of delight that we have specifically because of them? Are we giving them patience? Are we making eye contact with them? Are we looking to repair any potential damage if there is any? At the end of the day, I think you know, they're looking to see is there still room in our hearts as as parents for them, even though all this other stuff is going on. And and as parents, we know, oh, of course there is. Of course we love you, but sometimes we're not communicating that message with our body language and with our tone and and with all the nonverbal cues that we have throughout the day.

Kristy 9:30

I think as parents, we look at it as fair, right? Are we are we being fair in the way that we treat both kids, all the kids? I think if we look at it from a perspective that the parents giving more care or consideration to one of the siblings, or to maybe there's like an aging parent situation, and and somebody's giving attention outside the home to those grandparents, or maybe somebody in the family is getting long-term treatment, something like chemo, or or something like that, maybe a poor mental health season. I think if we look at that more in terms of almost like leveling the playing field, right? Like wherever there is somebody who's struggling, it makes sense that we're gonna put our resources more there. Fairness isn't making sure that everything is 50-50. I think it's more are we meeting the needs of each person, how they are and where they are? And does each kiddo know at the end of the day that they are loved and have some sort of connection point and the security of saying that they're also okay, you know, where where somebody else might not be okay?

Tony 10:48

I think we also need to remember that this is not about an endless trial. We're not trying to defend our actions in one place versus another. This is more of can we have that faithful wisdom? Can we show faithfulness to all the members of our family versus trying to keep an even score? Especially when it comes to our kids, we need to be able to stay tender enough towards all of our kids so that we notice when a kid is having a hard time because of the unevenness that maybe has to happen when a kid is feeling forgotten or you know, they're starting to really feel that unevenness. Are we tender enough to notice that emotion and to notice body language?

Kristy 11:49

The word that keeps coming to mind while we're talking through this is stewardship. Are we being good stewards of the resources that we have, the time, the bandwidth, all of those things, but also of the children and the family members that we're given? Are we doing the best we can with what we have to take care of everyone who's been gifted to us? It's never going to be perfection, even if there is no issue, even if there's no illness and no disability, no season situation that's difficult, just by virtue of having kids with different personalities, where maybe one is outgoing and super extroverted and whatever, and the other kid is quiet, maybe a little more introverted. Like I think there's always gonna be a difference in the ways that we relate to kids, like irrespective of disability. Once you add that in, I think it's a huge thing to have to balance, but there's always gotta be that balance. Makes me think about the parable of the lost sheep. The shepherd goes off and leaves the 99 to go fetch the one that wandered off. And the thing is, he doesn't leave the 99 because he doesn't care about them anymore. He leaves them because they're fine, because they're secure, they're safe, and the one that wandered off needs him. That one that wandered off is not going to be okay without the shepherd's immediate care. I think that just by nature of how the world works, love moves toward need. When there's a a need, a lack, a hurt, love is drawn toward that. When there's stability and safety, and when you have a relationship that allows that sort of trust, you know, of the other of the other 99 of the other kids, you're just helping the one who needs the most in the moment. Like Tony said, if that moment becomes you know a lifetime situation, I think it still matters. The relationship that we have is what's gonna make that safe. It's gonna, it's what's going to make the other kids have the security of those 99. It's that relationship. The question becomes: how do we raise kids who know that they're equally loved, equally valued, treasured scene when they're never going to require the same care as somebody else? Like that's the question is how do we do that?

Tony 14:22

That's a very different question to ask, but I wanted to go back to that story of the shepherd leaving the 99 to go after the one. It's in that parable, the meaning there, this is about God pursuing the lost. For our parenting perspective, like Kristy said, the 99 know that they're fine. The shepherd is is going after the one because that one is in danger. In a family, love is going to move towards that need and then come back to the 99. As parents, we're gonna gravitate towards the need first. This question of how do we raise children who know they are equally treasured, even when things aren't even all the time, it's one of those things that it goes back to what I was saying earlier. Are we just paying attention to how our kids are reacting to what's going on? When there is those stressful moments, even if they are routine, there's still going to be those, oh, it's another doctor appointment or another hospital visit or another therapy appointment. There's still stress that's involved in those things, even if they are on a set schedule. How are our other kids reacting to those things? If there is some tension, are we trying to meet the kids where they are? When needs are urgent, they're loud, they don't wait, they are going to skip in front of the line and you have to deal with them. But our steady kids become quiet. As parents, it's easy to think that, oh, if they're quiet, they're fine. But we should never mistake quiet for being fine. Sometimes that might be the case, but we can't always assume that. The more we assume that, the riskier things get, because that can be a very dangerous place to be when it comes to how our kids feeling. The capable child becomes the easy one. The sibling becomes emotionally invisible because we're so invested in the needs that are so loud on the other side. Are they quiet because they stop asking? Because they don't want to add to the things that we're dealing with, the things that they are achieving and accomplishing, they receive less and less attention. Eventually, it can get to a point where they feel like their feelings are inconvenient. We need to guard against that. Competence should never end up being a punishment.

Kristy 17:32

As parents were aware of that, I think that's the thing that plagues us earlier. Talking about how parents kind of measure that kind of thing. We're worried about are we spending the same amount of time? Are we making things fair? The more pertinent question becomes: are we seeing these kids as themselves? Do they have an identity beyond being the sister or brother of whoever? Tony, as you were just talking, I think what you were describing is kind of a worst-case situation. I don't think that has to be a default. I don't think it has to get there. What they need is just permission to have needs. We need to overtly state to them, your needs matter. Speak up. You're not helping a situation by making yourself smaller, as long as we are able to be proactive about those things and make sure that they understand that they're allowed to have maybe confusing, certainly complicated feelings. I get how it would be really frustrating to have mom or dad, you know, somebody can't ever come to your softball game because they have therapy with your siblings on that day, for example, or there's going to be times where there's resentment, but I don't think that has to be the default. I really don't. I think we need to make sure that they know that they are loved, seen, individual, just as important. And also that we don't put them in a situation where they're having to act as adults, right? I think all the things that we've been talking about are ways where kids have to emotionally sort of do the adult thing, right? And set their needs aside or handle their own stuff so that they don't become a nuisance or whatever. But also, I think it should be practical. They should also know that they're not required to be the one who keeps an eye on their sister or brother all the time, or that they're just not somehow made responsible in the way of being a third parent for those kiddos, one-on-one moments. It doesn't have to be hours, it doesn't have to even be necessarily outings on a regular basis, but just those moments. A dear friend who has a kiddo who is non-speaking, he's autistic, he's got struggles, you know, he's got a difficult road. He also has a brother. The brother happens to be an early riser. Uh, mom has made herself an early riser, and she gets up way beyond when when they need to to get ready to leave the house and has her coffee with the brother so that they have that connective time every morning. She's gonna go off and do the things she has to do, and a lot of that is prioritizing the brother. The morning kid knows that he can start his day, he can go off into the world every day feeling connected to his mom and knowing that they had you know a special little minute. She can hear about his what's going on that day, or you know, what he might be worried about, all of those things just in that little bit of time. And I'm not trying to say that 10 minutes in the morning is the checkoff, because that's not the case either. But I think just having something, having some sort of individual tradition or or ritual or time like that, just those one-to-one moments, they go a long way.

Tony 21:05

We've talked a lot about one side versus another side, but there's a specific element that I think need not get lost in the shuffle, especially with a kid that knows he has or she has a disability and knows that a lot of attention and resources are being paid to them, that they don't start feeling like a burden, where they start to apologize for every little thing, even though they need it and and it's a legitimate need, but they start to also then feel guilty because of all of the attention that is being paid to them when they didn't ask for it. It's a need, it's necessary. But they wish it wasn't so. We wouldn't be who we are if we didn't at least put that out there as well. Is that sometimes it can be the one that is getting all of the attention that really feels bad that they are getting all the attention.

Kristy 22:21

I guess I think that speaks to the importance of just there being a standard, right? A culture in that family where everybody is important, everybody belongs, everybody speaks up, and raising kids in an environment where everybody does what they have to do to keep the family going. Everybody does chores, there's some peace that everybody gives, and kids are unique, you know, kids don't have everything in common. Even siblings can be completely different from one another. But just knowing that each has a place and that without any of them, it wouldn't be the same. It's important to build security that way so that both the the kiddo that has the struggle and the kiddo that doesn't see that they're still part of a machine and they're both needed, you know, in the way that is that feels the best for the family.

Tony 23:15

It goes back to making sure that everyone knows that, like you said, that everyone belongs here and that everyone matters. We tell the truth to each other, and what that does is it allows people to say what they feel, and we receive that so that we can repair any unintentional damage that is out there. We're intentional about celebrating each person with whatever they accomplish and with whatever they achieve that they receive the recognition that they deserve. We don't pretend that hard things aren't hard. We live in a healthy reality that just acknowledges what is going on, and I think it's important to have that healthy standard of today may not revolve around me, but I am still part of what makes this family a family. Making sure that that standard is clear to every member of the family. You are valuable, you make this family what it is, but there may be days or there may be times or there may be seasons that things just aren't revolving around you specifically for any number of reasons. If that is communicated and lived out well, it helps avoid a lot of these issues.

Kristy 24:55

I agree with everything that you just said. I think if we're creating those protected moments, I think if we're just calling it out sometimes, right? Like we know your brother needs a lot of help. It's okay to say that out loud, make sure that if it's not equal time, that each kiddo does get some time, that everybody is celebrated. It's not that everything revolves around one, it's that the family has needs and we plan around those needs. And part of those needs is is what everybody needs, not just, you know, not just the one kiddo. And I think checking in with certainly with the you know, with the the healthy kiddo, but really maybe with both. I keep coming back to the point that you were making about how the kiddo who struggles may have a fair amount of guilt around that. You know, I think it's important ask them what's been hard lately? Like what has been difficult? You know, what's on your mind? What what have you felt like we have pushed aside maybe lately, or that we as a family we should probably talk about or something like that? What do you wish that I knew? What do you wish that I understood, or that your sister or brother understood better? You know, and hear them, like give them time, give them the floor, let them kind of vent it out a little bit. And then when you get that information, make use of it. When we know what's been hard, we can lend a hand there. I really have needed help with something and I didn't want to ask, or I've been struggling more with my illness or disability recently, and I just feel really bad about it. Or these are things we can talk about so that in addition to having a difficult situation, the kiddo doesn't also feel like they have to carry it on their own, that they have to deal with it on their own, not speaking up to defend ourselves, right, as parents and saying, well, but you know, I I did what I thought was best, or I had to. Like, I think it's okay to just say, like, you know, I get that. I I totally get how you feel that way, and I'm I'm so sorry that you know it sounds really difficult. Like, how can I support you better? I think it's okay to have those conversations, and I think it's important to have those conversations.

Tony 27:10

I love the way that you put that because that is kind of human instinct. When we hear somebody say something that is potentially some sort of critique about us, our natural instinct is to jump in and to try to like explain it away. And I get that, I get where that comes from, but I think the more faithful response is be able to say to the person that we're having the conversation with, thank you so much for telling me. I'm so sorry that you felt this way, opening up the conversation to say, help me to understand where you felt that the most, so that we can find either a way to avoid that in the future, or if these things are unavoidable, how do we mitigate those things to where you understand and I understand what's going on, and we find a better way forward. As parents, we're not perfect, we're gonna miss things, we're gonna overlook things, we're going to get pulled in in so many directions, and it's gonna get to a point where where we can get consumed by the need or the crisis or the stress or whatever. And so when we're having these honest conversations, it's not about perfection, it's about that repair. Are we looking to repair the damage, even if the damage was unintentional? A secure child isn't gonna be one that the parents are perfect because again, we're not going to be perfect. A secure child isn't gonna be one where the parents never miss anything. A secure child is going to have parents who come back, tell the truth, and repair. Step one in that process may be being willing to ask a potentially hard question and being willing to hear a hard answer that we don't want to hear because in our heart of hearts we already know that answer is coming, but to look our kids in the eye and to allow them to vocalize it, it does something so important because it it it says to the kid, not only do I want to hear you, but I want you to know that you have been heard, and the best way to do that is to allow you to actually vocalize the words out loud. It's important that we take that time to do this because it's you know, it's it's not about guilt, you know, it's about repair. If this turns into a thing about guilt, then what is dangerous and easy to happen is that now guilt becomes the ringleader, and that's not where we need to be at all. Guilt is is going to be a terrible shepherd for where we want to go as a family. We need to go with a mindset of repair so that we can go forward in a place of love and honesty and apology and steadiness for our entire family.

Kristy 30:48

As you've been talking here the last minute or so, the thing that keeps coming back to my brain is it's about communication, right? It's about asking. I think as parents, we tend to fault ourselves for things that aren't really the things that matter that much to our kids. And sometimes we miss the things that do matter. I think we can beat ourselves up about the way that we divvy up our time, that we divvy up our energy and resources and that kind of thing. But I think hearing the kids, asking them, hey, how's it going? You know, having those check-ins, what's been difficult lately? What do you wish that I knew? What do you wish that I had done differently? How can I do better going forward? Like all of these things just bring information so that a parent isn't beating herself or himself up for crimes that that didn't hurt anybody. Um, and that we are paying attention to the things that matter, to the to the actual situations that bring stress or sadness or distance. In a family where we have difficult situations, illness, disability, anything like that, time is already limited. Like let's not waste it feeling bad about things that we can't do anything about and that that probably aren't the actual heart of the matter. And let's communicate, let's talk to our kids, let's talk to our spouses, you know, and hear people out. And then that way, when we can identify a situation or or place a lever where we can make a difference, where we can make things better, let's use the time and reasons that we have there. Like let's fix it, let's find a way to go forward, not let guilt drive the boat.

Tony 32:34

If you're listening to this and you're thinking, man, I didn't do this perfectly. Spoiler alert, none of us do. We can start in a better way today. We can have one conversation, start with a single moment, whether that's breakfast early in the morning, maybe it's uh a quick check-in. Hey, how are you doing? No matter what, you can't make every need equal. We're not called to do that, we're not asked to do that. But what we can do is we can make sure that every child is secure. Doing that is more important than any sort of scorekeeping or fairness or anything else you you can throw at it because it's never going to be equal. But we can do everything in our power to make sure that every child is secure. Like Kristy said, it's it's the communication, it's the love, it's the attention, it's the truth, it's the reassurance, it's all of these things to be able to provide for the security that we want our kids and ultimately our entire family to have.

Kristy 33:58

Thinking to ourselves, who needs me most right now, and who needs a reminder that they're important, that they're vital, important part of the family. Like just keeping those questions in mind, I think is going to always steer us well. Love goes where the need is the greatest, but I think it also then circles around and follows up, making sure that we're intentional about our effort and our energy, and making sure that we we follow up with everybody and touch base with everybody and make sure that everybody knows that they're not secondary. Just because your need isn't the greatest need in the minute, it doesn't make you less, it doesn't make you less important, less significant, you're not forgotten. And your place in the family, like this family, is rock solid. It's it's your place has never been in question. You're always our baby, you know, our our kiddo, and we love you. Like Tony said, when we mess up, we're gonna do our best to fix it, but we're also gonna do the best we can to build security, to use our effort on a continual basis to shore up that security so that when those tough moments come for somebody else, that one quiet kiddo, they don't forget that they're loved deeply and that they belong.

Tony 35:18

This is not about trying harder. This is about coming back, telling the truth, repairing where it's needed, and reminding every person in your family that they are not secondary, they're not forgotten, and they're not outside the love of the home here. When we're able to do those things, I think that's when we have that truly secure home.

Kristy 35:49

Let's pray, you guys. God, we come before you just very grateful for the kiddos and the situations and the families and just the lives that you have gifted us with. We are so, so thankful for the opportunities every day to interact and to love one another. We pray for your guidance in just making sure that we are the best stewards that we can be of these precious gifts that you've given us, particularly these kiddos. Guide us, help us to uh to build stability for for every child and just to love well, to love on a case-by-case basis as each kiddo needs us in the moment. We're so grateful that you love us that way. When we get it wrong and when we get it right, you're there. And your grace and your loving kindness, we couldn't overstate it. We just thank you so much and we praise you for that. We love you and we pray that you'll be with us and with our friends in this coming week. Let us make good, smart decisions and love well and just honor you and everything that we do. We're so grateful. We love you, and we ask all things in the beautiful name of Jesus. Amen.

Tony 37:11

Amen. Thank you guys so much. Hope you guys have a great rest of your day and a great rest of your week, and we'll see you next time.

Kristy 37:19

Bye, everyone.